Fellow Christian blogger Miriam has a post on her site titled “Is Barack Obama Satan’s Warm-Up Act?” which takes a look at how “Left Behind” creator Tim LaHaye voiced his opinion on this question. Not surprisingly, most of the reader comments are focused on the timing of the “rapture,” when the Saints are removed from the earth and join Jesus the Christ.
I have written about this subject so many times, but it always resurfaces. Who wants to believe they will have to try and live under Satan’s evil, psychotic rule on earth? Anyway, here is my response to Miriam’s post… and my response of course grew in length to become this blog post:
I love how reaction to a post on President Barack Obama allegedly being the pre-cursor to the anti-Christ turns into a debate on the snatching away of Christ Jesus’ Bride, the Church.
I have looked at this debate pretty extensively myself… and it doesn’t matter what I believe concerning this really. If Christ comes and gets my elderly mother before Satan is granted power over us or after… our destination is still Christ’s Kingdom. As a young Christian alive during this generation, I very well expect there may be a day that I’ll die or be imprisoned for confessing Christ Jesus as LORD. That’s just life.
Some questions plaguing me nowadays about the timing of this snatching away (rapture) are from this passage in 2 Thessalonians 2:
1 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come.
[LaVrai - The day of Christ has not come as yet, obviously]
3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
[LaVrai - The Day of Christ Jesus' return won't come unless the falling away comes first. Isn't the "falling away" referring to the c/Church losing a great number of people? If the number wasn't significant, would it even be issued as a sign of the time? Some even speculate that a revelation of a mid or post-tribulation rapture will cause the falling away...
[Also, the son of perdition, i.e., the anti-Christ must be revealed before that Day of Christ's coming, says the writer. Is it common knowledge who the ant-Christ is right now... or just speculation? The writer makes it seem as if no guessing or speculation will be necessary when the anti-Christ is revealed; as no guessing will be needed when Christ returns... as HIS re-appearance will be like lightning streaking across the skies.]
5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming.
[LaVrai - Is the Holy Spirit the ONE restraining "the mystery of lawlessness?" Is the writer saying that when this mystery is no longer a mystery but in the open for all to see, then the Holy Spirit will have removed HIMSELF... since this is the time granted for Satan to persecute GOD's people? (see note below on the Book of Daniel)]
9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
This leads me to another passage in Daniel in which an angel explains Daniel’s visions, telling him about the time Satan/the anti-Christ will be granted power over the Saints…
Daniel 7:19 “Then I wished to know the truth about the fourth beast, which was different from all the others, exceedingly dreadful, with its teeth of iron and its nails of bronze, which devoured, broke in pieces, and trampled the residue with its feet; 20 and the ten horns that were on its head, and the other horn which came up, before which three fell, namely, that horn which had eyes and a mouth which spoke pompous words, whose appearance was greater than his fellows (see Revelation 17).
21 “I was watching; and the same horn was making war against the saints, and prevailing against them, 22 until the Ancient of Days came, and a judgment was made in favor of the saints of the Most High, and the time came for the saints to possess the kingdom.
23 “Thus he said: ‘ The fourth beast shall be a fourth kingdom on earth, which shall be different from all other kingdoms, And shall devour the whole earth, trample it and break it in pieces. 24 The ten horns are ten kings who shall arise from this kingdom. And another shall rise after them; he shall be different from the first ones, and shall subdue three kings.
25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, shall persecute the saints of the Most High, and shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand for a time and times and half a time.
What Saints could he possibly be referring to if we’re all gone before persecution comes?
Do we really believe once the Saints are “raptured” that those left behind will suddenly find faith in Christ Jesus? I find it unlikely, that those in the world will come to a mass understanding of what happened to the millions who used to live among them. No way. It’s even likely the powers that be will fake the funk as long as they can, possibly even making it seem as if they are the righteous ones and have inherited the earth while the Saints are the wicked ones and have been destroyed from among them. Don’t you now that Satan reads the Holy Scriptures, too (read the temptation of our LORD and SAVIOR Jesus the Christ) and is making his plans for this time (mostly in vain)?
Christ Jesus has given us so many clues, signs that preceed HIS return. HE implores us to be ready, no matter the day or time, for only GOD the FATHER knows the exact day and time of Christ Jesus’ return. As we see these signs unfolding, we are instructed to look up, for HIS arrival surely draws near. We should be checking our oil daily, to make sure we are prepared… and fully dressed so that nothing would impeded us if the LORD suddenly re-appears and says, “It is now. Come.”
No escape before Satan is granted power over GOD’s people — this could very well be the patience of the Saints.
Good post LaVrai. These verses are pretty conclusive that there will be saints on the earth and satan will persecute them… I have to say that I see in the book of Revelation a distinct difference between the persecution of satan and the Wrath of God.
Rev 6:2 And I looked, and behold, a white horse! And its rider had a bow, and a crown was given to him, and he came out conquering, and to conquer.
The above verse I think, speaks of satan as a counterfeit christ, the rider of the white horse is a conqueror, then what follows is the persecution by the other riders who are tools of this first rider.
After satan’s persecution the souls of the saints are under the alter (at this stage they are not under the throne, that comes later)
Rev 6:9 When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne
Rev 6:10 They cried out with a loud voice, “O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before you will judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?”
Rev 6:11 Then they were each given a white robe and told to rest a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and their brothers should be complete, who were to be killed as they themselves had been.
Then we have the sixth seal:
Rev 6:12 When he opened the sixth seal, I looked, and behold, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black as sackcloth, the full moon became like blood,
and this aligns with Matthew:
Mat 24:29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
Then it speaks about the Kings of the earth and other great ones and generals who will be the subject of the wrath of the Lamb, these people are going to be experiencing the wrath of the Lamb, not the wrath of rider on the white horse:
Rev 6:13 and the stars of the sky fell to the earth as the fig tree sheds its winter fruit when shaken by a gale.
Rev 6:14 The sky vanished like a scroll that is being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place.
Rev 6:15 Then the kings of the earth and the great ones and the generals and the rich and the powerful, and everyone, slave and free, hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains,
Rev 6:16 calling to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who is seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb,
Rev 6:17 for the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?”
Then in heaven there is the multitude of those who have come out of the great tribulation:
Rev 7:9 After this I looked, and behold, a great multitude that no one could number, from every nation, from all tribes and peoples and languages, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed in white robes, with palm branches in their hands,
Rev 7:10 and crying out with a loud voice, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!”
Rev 7:13 Then one of the elders addressed me, saying, “Who are these, clothed in white robes, and from where have they come?”
Rev 7:14 I said to him, “Sir, you know.” And he said to me, “These are the ones coming out of the great tribulation. They have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
This multitude are before the throne of God (not under the alter anymore, that in itself would be an interesting study, the difference between the alter and the throne!) the throne of God will will now shelter them:
Rev 7:15 “Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple; and he who sits on the throne will shelter them with his presence.
Rev 7:16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst anymore; the sun shall not strike them, nor any scorching heat.
Rev 7:17 For the Lamb in the midst of the throne will be their shepherd, and he will guide them to springs of living water, and God will wipe away every tear from their eyes.”
I believe this to be the point of the rapture, in between the sixth and seventh seal.
In my humble opinion, that is what I read from the above verses.
Virginia Snape’s last blog post..Marxism and Fascism is coming to America
Yes, Vee, what you say is quite possible. Someone raised a point I hadn’t considered previously – about the part in “2 Thessalonians 2:7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way.” I failed to link above the removal of the Holy Spirit with the removal of GOD’s people. We can do nothing on earth without HIM, no? And the LORD promised to never leave us or forsake us. So this removal of the Holy Spirit, likely also refers to the removal of the Saints… which seems very likely to be well after the tribulation period has started, as you suggest.